Quick reply to a Preterist
I received a rebuttal from somebody who disliked my recent article how we can know that the events of Revelation haven’t been entirely fulfilled yet.
I’ll break the message into parts and reply to them in turn.
First of all, Terry, you think you can find fulfillment of the Book of Revelation according to the “history books” of men. That’s the fatal mistake people make. Let God be true and every man a liar.
How convenient that you don’t need to know anything about history because you can just wave your hand and dismiss it! Ignorance is a blessing, huh? But the beauty of history is that Christians have been around the whole time since the New Testament, spreading across the world, and they have always been writing. You obviously don’t know this because you don’t care about the truth, but history is a series of ongoing debates and dialogues between people who discuss facts from various perspectives. It’s not one monolithic version of events controlled by some central liar, like your grade school textbook. You should bother to learn something some time.
The very first verse of the Book of Revelation says, “Things which must shortly come to pass....” and just two verses later “the time is at hand.” It’s not up to us to go to man’s “history books” to see how God’s Word was or was not fulfilled.
And I address this in my book Maybe Everyone Is Wrong. My interpretation does acknowledge that the events in the book of Revelation did begin to transpire very early. In a way it was already happening, as Satan was on earth generating the conspiracy that would take thousands of years to reach its apex.
Then, Rev 22:10 again confirms the time stamp - And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
The time was at hand for these history-shaping events to begin to unfold. And if you cared about the design of the prophecy itself, you would see that they unfold one event at a time, in sequence. They are a progression, not all at once.
So the beginning of the Book offers the time stamp and the end of the Book offers the time stamp. Everything from the beginning to the end occurred just like the Book says.
Revelation does not say that it has all occurred already. It describes a massive, world-changing series of events that build on one another, until eventually we see things that have never happened yet. You don’t have any explanation for how these things “happened” already, so you’re blabbering.
The worst thing about this horrible futurism message is that the New Covenant is implemented inside the Book. Hence, the New Covenant has never occurred for you folks and this is why you can’t see the truth that’s right in front of your faces.
How pathetic. You have so little evidence that you have to falsely imply that I don’t believe there’s a new covenant in effect?
Once again, the preterist has no evidence whatsoever, but relies on twisting and stretching one or two words to their uttermost limit, while completely dismissing all historical evidence, or even the idea of learning about what God has been doing for the last 2,000 years.
"Replying to your Quick Reply", Terry. It will require multiple posts due to SS limitations.
Part 1
I’ll break the message into parts and reply to them in turn.
First of all, Terry, you think you can find fulfillment of the Book of Revelation according to the “history books” of men. That’s the fatal mistake people make. Let God be true and every man a liar.
How convenient that you don’t need to know anything about history because you can just wave your hand and dismiss it! Ignorance is a blessing, huh? But the beauty of history is that Christians have been around the whole time since the New Testament, spreading across the world, and they have always been writing. You obviously don’t know this because you don’t care about the truth, but history is a series of ongoing debates and dialogues between people who discuss facts from various perspectives. It’s not one monolithic version of events controlled by some central liar, like your grade school textbook. You should bother to learn something some time.
One of the first things that people do who cannot intelligently argue their position, is personally attack the one that opposes them.
You are the one demanding that man's history books are necessary to validate the Word of God. Man cannot get history correct from yesterday - let alone 2,000 years ago. And, is your belief in “history” and “Christians” - are you referring to the catholic “church?”
The very first verse of the Book of Revelation says, “Things which must shortly come to pass....” and just two verses later “the time is at hand.” It’s not up to us to go to man’s “history books” to see how God’s Word was or was not fulfilled.
And I address this in my book Maybe Everyone Is Wrong. My interpretation does acknowledge that the events in the book of Revelation did begin to transpire very early. In a way it was already happening, as Satan was on earth generating the conspiracy that would take thousands of years to reach its apex.
No where does the Book say such a thing. The Book says “The things which must shortly come to pass.” If it was supposed to be understood as events that would occur over thousands of years - it could have just as easily have said so.
When the angel told Daniel of his vision, in Daniel chapter 12, the angel instructed Daniel: O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. Then, when Christ was speaking to His disciples concerning “the end” - He told His disciples to Read and Understand Daniel - clearly meaning that the Book of Daniel had been unsealed - why? - because THEY were in the time of the end. The difference in time between the angel telling Daniel to seal up his Book - was 490 years. After 490 years - the Book of Daniel was unsealed.
Contrast this to what the angel told John regarding his vision. In Revelation 22:10, the angel tells John NOT TO SEAL up the prophecy of the Book: FOR THE TIME IS AT HAND.
On these facts alone, your theory concerning thousands of years required for fulfillment fails - and fails miserably.
The only justification that you could possibly bring to the table is the ONE thousand years of Rev 20. And that's ONE thousand - not thousands.
I do not have the same conclusion - but I doubt that you know ( it is history, afterall ) that the translators of the Geneva Bible from 1560 and 1590 - did believe that the 1,000 years of Rev 20 were a literal 1,000 years - and they had that ending at 1070 AD - providing their understanding of the historical events that took place at that time ( I wonder if you have any idea what “history” says occurred at that time? ).
Then, Rev 22:10 again confirms the time stamp - And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
The time was at hand for these history-shaping events to begin to unfold. And if you cared about the design of the prophecy itself, you would see that they unfold one event at a time, in sequence. They are a progression, not all at once.
Exactly. But they must all fit inside “the things which must shortly come to pass” and “Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this Book: for the time is at hand.” Your refusal to submit to the Authority of the Word of God is what had led to your woeful misunderstandings - which has led to your refusal to embrace the New Covenant - which occurs clearly between the time-stamps of the Book - and which clearly began in the first century.
So the beginning of the Book offers the time stamp and the end of the Book offers the time stamp. Everything from the beginning to the end occurred just like the Book says.
Revelation does not say that it has all occurred already. It describes a massive, world-changing series of events that build on one another, until eventually we see things that have never happened yet. You don’t have any explanation for how these things “happened” already, so you’re blabbering.
The Book of Revelation is indeed describing world-changing events. It's the imagery that describes the passing of the Old Covenant and the establishing of the New Covenant World.
And again, you step back to what seems to be a pattern for you - insulting those that don't see it your way.
I don't need man's fake “history” books in order to understand that the Old Covenant World melted in a fervent heat. I don't need man's fake “history” books to tell me that the New Heavens and the New Earth are symbolic language for the prophesied, promised Kingdom of God that was fully and completely established when the temple - the center of the entire Israelite world was destroyed - not one stone left standing upon another. Yes. When that temple came down - the entire world had a massive, world changing event. Your twisted understandings minimize what happened to the world when that temple was destroyed. And the failure to understand is what keeps people from finding and entering into the New Covenant World of the Kingdom of God.
The worst thing about this horrible futurism message is that the New Covenant is implemented inside the Book. Hence, the New Covenant has never occurred for you folks and this is why you can’t see the truth that’s right in front of your faces.
How pathetic. You have so little evidence that you have to falsely imply that I don’t believe there’s a new covenant in effect?
I just read about the inadequacies of archeology. How can we be sure that historical documents are correctly dated, or be legit in the first place?
https://biostoicwarrior.substack.com/p/the-forgotten-science-of-chronology?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android&selection=6c6427d7-ff29-4369-b409-8cbe258a9d8b&r=18nw3z